Rinoa = Ultimecia

[Honest Abel]

Know what you're thinking. "How is it possible that Ultimecia and Rinoa are the same person? No way, you're crazy!" But the idea is an interesting, complicated, and very possible theory. Keep an open mind, and think about it. The Main Point? Ultimecia is the future Rinoa. Rinoa grows up to become Ultimecia. When Rinoa is older, some great tragedy could occur that deeply affects Rinoa and changes her slowly. This could be the death of Squall (or other loved ones) or some other disaster that happens in the FF8 world. Slowly over time, she grows more depressed, and her sorceress powers feed the dark sadness inside of her. Her sorceress powers prevent her from dying naturally and continues to live for eons alone. Eventually, gripping on the brink of insanity, she becomes Ultimecia. This would explain why Squall shows up in the game Kingdom Hearts without his love Rinoa, perhaps they were seperated. Ultimecia's intentions? Ultimecia/Rinoa wants to go back to the good ol times. Before tragedy would strike her, when she she was with her friends during the timeline of FF8. So she dedicates herself to going back in time. Maybe she wants to prevent the disaster that will happen, or to warn the young Rinoa of the future. Regardless, because of the long, sad evolution from Rinoa into the cold-hearted Ultimecia, she's messed up by the time she accomplishes time travel. Thus doing more evil when she gets there, than good. Evidence? One, Squall's ring Griever and Ultimecia's summon Griever. Coincidence that they're both the same name, and that the game put an emphasis on naming Griever? I think not. Ultimecia named her summon Griever as it was one of the memories of her past life as Rinoa. Two, they're both sorceresses. That's not a common power identity to have, sorceresses are rare. Three, Rinoa's symbol if white angel wings and Ultimecia has black angel wings. Black wings are the symbol for fallen angels, just like how Rinoa has fallen from pure white wings, to darker ones. Four, Ultimecia's castle is located near the same place as Rinoa's "Promise" flower field. The love Rinoa felt for Squall led Ultimecia back to the place she made a promise. See, she did wait for him there. But Rinoa is good and Ulti is evil, right? Like Squall says, "There's no right or wrong. Just two sides with different views." Anyway, anyone can attest to the fact that PEOPLE CHANGE over time. Can you honestly say you haven't changed at all during your lifetime? Most likely, in the past years, you do things you never thought you would've done years ago. Humans change constantly. Now factor in that Rinoa is leading an extraordinary life. She's in a fantasy world with lots of adventure, drama, emotions, and powers. As sad as it is to think angel Rinoa could become evil Ultimecia, remember: People change. Why Kill SeeDs? Obviously, after all those lonely eras of turning into Ultimecia could easily drive Ulti/Rinoa to insanity. Power corrupts. And it's quite possible she's lost it to the point where her conscious can't even recognize her friends anymore. Or maybe we dont give Ulti enough credit. SHe could've known all along how this would play out. She always said that a SeeD was prophesize to destroy her. Ulti/Rinoa knew her attempts to kill the SeeDs would bring everyone together, and did it to bring about the good relationships that resulted from her war. Deep down in her subconscious, she knew she would die. Even while her evil outside was being.. well, evil. Or maybe she wanted to kill Rinoa because she didn't want her to go through the pain she would, Ulti/Rinoa wanted to end her own life. Or she wanted to take over the world to be in control, she bad things wouldn't happen. After being unable to prevent bad things around her for so long, Ulti/Rinoa would think of such a thing. There are many possibilities in the Rinoa=Ultimecia theory. Squaresoft left so many open ends in the story, we can only begin to imagine.

[Ashley]

I had a theory simular to this on old FFE, I can't spring up any new points because those were my main ones, and I haven't played FF8 in so long to think up some minor details.

Just wait for Lady Rinoa to log on, she was my main opposition about this theory, she thinks FF8 is a love story and that would ruin it.

[Honest Abel]

A love story? FFVIII is anything but a love story.

[Ashley]

Agreed. Imho, I think the whole Rinoa is Ultimecia story actually makes FF8 a lot more interesting, it makes her less of a static character. The majority of the players were sick of Rinoa after her introduction, but if she were to actually be the main villian, it makes her a whole lot more tolerable, gives her some developement. Not spoiled rich girl falls in love, but spoiled rich girl loses her love(or some sort of tragedy) and falls from grace.

[Exodus]

FFVIII was far from a love story, it was more of an action/adventure/political game, if it was anything.

srsly.

[The Dude]

Don't forget science fiction. What with the fights in outer space and an epic battle with guns blazing. Love story my eye.

[Honest Abel]

It definitely had a couple political points to make. Also focused on societal issues like orphans, army, school, etc. To say it was a love story is ridiculous.

[Exodus]

Originally Posted by MistaRob

Don't forget science fiction. What with the fights in outer space and an epic battle with guns blazing. Love story my eye.

Right! How could I forget that?

Not to mention the gunblades and the Lunatic Pandora and that blasted shield. And Garden.

[Larsa]

Thats's the one problem I think FFVIII has, it doen't have an ending were you can say that's enough. No ther're so many things in FFVIII that you have to keep thinking about.

[Honest Abel]

For example, you need to keep thinking about if Rinoa is Ultimecia and simply hope one day that a sequel is made that addresses the issue.

[Ugly Casanova]

Originally Posted by Ashley

Just wait for Lady Rinoa to log on, she was my main opposition about this theory, she thinks FF8 is a love story and that would ruin it.

It's obivously a love story between Edea and Cid....Durr.

[ThroneofDravaris]

I love it when this theory comes up on forums every so often as if it's something new. Suffice to say, there isn't a single point to the theory that stays true to Occum's Razor, the underlying principal (ie that sorceresses live forever/never age) has been debunked by official SquareEnix material and the whole thing in general should be taken with a grain of salt.

On that note: edited

[Tom]

Actually, despite all the explainations, you guys who think Rinoa is Ultimacea are overlooking one minor detail.

[spoiler]Before Rinoa opens herself to Ultimacea in Esthar, Laguna says one little line to throw all theories to the grave. Laguna clearly states, if my memory serves me correctly, something to the extent of "And since Ultimacea lives too far into the future for any of us to see her, ..." So no matter how long Rinoa is going to live now that she's a sorceress, Ultimacea still lives too far into the future. Play the game, and when they all meet at Laguna's place to discuss time compression, read carefully.[/spoiler]

[Exodus]

Originally Posted by Auron

Actually, despite all the explainations, you guys who think Rinoa is Ultimacea are overlooking one minor detail.

[spoiler]Before Rinoa opens herself to Ultimacea in Esthar, Laguna says one little line to throw all theories to the grave. Laguna clearly states, if my memory serves me correctly, something to the extent of "And since Ultimacea lives too far into the future for any of us to see her, ..." So no matter how long Rinoa is going to live now that she's a sorceress, Ultimacea still lives too far into the future. Play the game, and when they all meet at Laguna's place to discuss time compression, read carefully.[/spoiler]

Touché.

[Lennon Legend]

So anyway, why the significance on griever is this theory is incorrect? Eh, you gays?

[My Final Heaven]

Originally Posted by Freudian Slip

It's obivously a love story between Edea and Cid....Durr.

Oh **** it is? I thought it was a love story between Zell and Hot dogs...

[Exodus]

Obviously it's both, with a mix of politics, science fiction, and action. Seeing as Squall and Rinoa thought of each other as siblings more than lovers, it obviously didn't revolve around them.

[Eve L.]

Could it be possible that Ultimecia had gone to the past knowing that she was destined to die by Seed in order to free herself. Maybe in the future the sorrow had gotten sooo bad that she went to the past to make sure the prophecy was fulfilled. It could be a possibility...

[Aston]

I don't know what to think anymore. I never thought at first that Rinoa could be ultemecia, but, its a possibility. ;o

[Spira]

if memory serves me well, theres an entire gamefaq article on the Rinoa - Ultimecia theory.. which I believe is actually true. For one thing, it would give Ultimecia the most depth of all Final Fantasy villians ever. You actually played her all the way in the story.

I think Square wanted to be a little open-ended about this.. but you can see this was implied in the ending when they did the Ultimecia's face over Rinoa's face thing