Why no Cerberus?

[DuMbAsS]

Good points VT. Didn't the KH team say it wasn't going to be named KH3 when it was finished anyways and that KH3 is only the codename for the time for all of us fan members. Also, Sora, Riku, and Kairi's parents are on Destiny Islands. It's too bad we can't visit there. Maybe in KH3 the main character makes a visit there or something cos Destiny Islands was a pretty big place also. It even connected to Kingdom Hearts. Well whatever about that. As for Montblanc, uh... I guess you're as right as can be. That would be a disgrace to him. Darn the mog look. Even though you didn't see Montblanc in action (cept for in FFTA, but that was generic fighting), he was pretty badass IMO.

Again, we might have to think about how this game takes place during past events to Sora. So instead of Cloud we may see Zack instead. And with that we may also see Genisis. You can only hope that SE doesn't put Genisis in. Although they might put Sephy in for Zack as well. Darn that luck. Well you get the point. The game takes place before Sora and co. Oh yeah that reminds me, didn't Leon(Squall) say something about, how he changed his name to Leon to escape something? They'll probably make it to where his name is Squall this time around see as it's before anything happened. Also, I just remembered that Squall from KH1 was reference to Laguna. Long hair and a short sleeve jacket over a white shirt. Sound like Laguna to anyone? So I guess it's no need for Laguna then.

[Lady Lamont]

Yup, agreed with VT. Those are just rumours (I can confirm that absolutely, and Nomura with the KH team are already tied up with Birth By Sleep, Fabula Nova Crystallis, Third Birthday and Nomura wants to make ANOTHER Dissidia game, but was rejected due to having too many projects at once).

And yes, about the comment about Zell... the jokes and taunts Sir Seifer does to Zell in the Japanese version are much more targeted towards that idea, it was carried over to the English version, to a lesser extent as a lot of the dialogue was actually censored which is why it's confusing as to when Squall refuses to shake Zell's hand, Sir Seifer laughing at that and plenty of other things.

Yes, Leon/Squall in KH was a reference to Laguna however Squall's initial design had him with long hair and Yusuke made Nomura change his design as it looked too feminine. He also said he changed his name to "escape the past" (as he failed to stop the Heartless from getting into his world and failed to protect Rinoa).

As much as I'd love to see Montblanc... it really would disgrace him. He's my favorite Moogle, and I know it wouldn't work out with him in it. The only reason I suggested the Fon Ronsenburg twins is because I'd love to see a character get confused between them (sort of a reference to identical twins pretending to be each other, considering with XII itself).

I'd prefer to see Zack instead of Cloud, hell give me Genesis over Sephiroth. I just do NOT want to see Cloud and Sephiroth in the games YET AGAIN.

[Vermilion Thanatos]

Damn. I forgot about Zack...

I don't want Zack in. Zack's fanbase is 99% fangirls who've never even played the original VII, and the game that popularized him never should have happened. I even watched the cutscenes to see what everyone was so crazy about, and I still didn't get why he's so popular, because he's basically Cloud but with a little bit of Tidus's annoying naivety stuck in there. Which forced me to conclude that the only reason the girls like him is the same reason they like genesis; they're bishies.

And yet, despite all this, I fear you are right that Zack will be in KH III, and I can't do anything to stop such a travesty. No, despite the odds, I will keep hope that the only new VII cameo will be Vincent, and that it will be the start of a complete halt of VII Compilation favoritism.

So wait, Nomura already wants to make another Dissidia? That's great. Though I'd prefer it if after he finishes a few games he starts on KH III first. Which could be in the next year or so, seeing as BBS, FF XIII, and Third Birthday should be released by Q2 at the latest. That only leaves him with Versus and Agito, and he could pick up Dissidia 2 and KH III and everything would be dandy.

[GRAV]

.....wow this thread picked up^^

Also.....i feel so.....so....iuno....childish and stoopid compared to you guys. damned indepth explanations and debates.

As for the hate towards the continuation of VII, i dont get it. in all honesty, i have NO IDEA why everyone is so sick and tired of Cloud V Sephiroth.

Anyhows, i agree to all of you peoples!! cept fro the VII hate and so on. i also think Rikku and a few others should get better roles an so on.

I HATE MONTBLANC!! *BLEH*!!! lol.

HUZZAH FOR BASCH AND HIS BRO!!! FTW!

[Vermilion Thanatos]

People are tired of Cloud vs. Sephiroth because it's become so common. The ending of VII was epic enough, though that was largely due to it being the first FF in 3D. If VI or IV had been of comparably visual quality, they'd no doubt be more popular than VII, because they actually had more interesting characters and plot.

Kingdom Hearts brought back Cloud and Sephiroth, and since FF gained popularity because of VII's jump to 3D, people were glad to face Cloud (and Leon) in a battle, and Nomura rightly assumed that fans would greatly enjoy facing Sephy as well. Sephy was still overhyped, but it was more of a reunion of sorts so it was fine and helped give KH enough popularity for a sequel.

With Cloud and Sephy revived and thriving thanks to KH's strategic cameos, they felt justified in making Advent Children, which was a terribly thought out sequel created purely for the excuse to have Cloud vs. Sephy again. By now, fans were getting a little antsy, but there were still plenty who were fine with it because the graphics were pretty (pretty graphics always seem to excuse terrible writing).

With the success of AC came Dirge of Cerberus, which had to have a Cloud cameo, and even though it was a terrible game, enough of the new FF fans, the ones who had only ever heard of VII, to buy it and try it out. So the sales justified continuing the series. So we get more pointless spinoffs like Crisis Core (more Sephy and Cloud) and a second DoC that are guaranteed to lack in either gameplay and/or story because at this point VII has become a brand that people will buy no matter how terrible the quality.

In comes KH II, which thinks it's okay to hop on the bandwagon it should never have created. It included the same damn conflict between Sephy and Cloud, just because at this point that's all the KH/FF VII fangirls want, not even anything interesting, just "let's throw Sephy and Cloud in there because that sells crap." And by this point, even before Dirge of Cerberus and Crisis Core were released, anyone who had been around longer than this stupid fad started is beginning to realize exactly how REPETITIVE and BORING it is to see:

Cloud: I'm so emo and sad, I should kill myself

Sephy: No, I want to kill you

*sword slashies*

Sephy: Arggghh...I'll be back...of this I am certain because I've done it half a dozen times already

So, by the time Dissidia came out, with the exception of the retarded Zack fangirls who actually thought that second-rate filler character ever deserved another cameo, everyone knew that it would be Cloud vs. Sephy again, and everyone who had grown wise to this crap recycling heaved a great sigh and screamed to the heavens "WILL THE MADNESS NEVER STOP?!?!?!?" And, of course, Cloud and Sephy are the easiest characters to play in the game, because let's face it, most Cloud and Sephy fans aren't true FF fans, and probably aren't even good gamers. Stupid fangirls.

THAT is why Cloud vs. Sephy sucks. It is overused to the point that any more cameos automatically labels a game as unoriginal. SE developers could find much more innovative things to add to their games than keep redoing the same **** all over again.

So, the short answer is: no one here hates VII. We hate the stupidly loyral "fans" who've never tried any of the other FFs, or even worse, haven't even tried VII itself. And we hate what VII has become, being whored out repeatedly in crappy spin-offs to said fanbase of retards. VII was a good game, but not deserving of this much attention. SE should have left it alone.

You know what? I don't want a VIII sequel anymore. Even a single X sequel failed...I just couldn't bear to watch SE drive another classic into the garbage-filled pits of fanservice hell.

[DuMbAsS]

lol long rant. maybe it should've went to the rant your face off board.

Anyways, what VT said is true. None truly hate VII. Personally I wouldn't mind a Cloud ONLY cameo be it small. As Cloud would be fine alone, so long as NOTHING about Sephy shows up as it can only lead to this repetitive cycle that VT just so gracefully told.

Zack fanboyism/girlism (?) got out of hand as soon as Before Crisis/Crisis Core was released. I don't mind him at all either. In fact I liked how SE decided to explain about him as I felt that Zack wasn't well explained in VII other than that he was Cloud's first best friend (aside from Tifa, but even she didn't remember anything about Cloud, but that promise). Anyways (I'm rambling again), the fan base went crazy with the Zack virus as well now. So it seems pointless.

Well said VT. No need for sequels for any of the other FFs now also. We already saw how bad it can get. As for remakes, it's understandable, but some...

lol Gravs back!

[Vermilion Thanatos]

A minor change: Cecil is now officially more likely than Kain. I forgot to consider the fact that although interesting characters are more likely than main characters, characters with parallel themes to KH are even more likely. Cecil has the whole "light/darkness" thing going on. I wouldn't mind if they included him, even though I still think there are better cameos.

EDIT: And now I find myself eating my words yet again. Kain is now apparently both a dark dragoon and a holy dragoon, so despite this being in a spinoff (AC and X-2 were also given special consideration as well), I'd say that he's more likely than Cecil...

[BarretFTW]

Good. Kain's a man's man, Cecil whines too much...

[DuMbAsS]

lol nice one Barret and HELLS YEAH! While I like Cecil, he's just no match for Kain.

[Vermilion Thanatos]

And I just realized one slot I forgot to fill. As much as I hate cute characters, I am almost certain that because of the nature of Kingdom Hearts, we will have another token kawaii and/or shota and/or lolita character thrown in to please the rabid fangirls. Any predictions?

My thoughts: lessee, there's Relm, there's young Rydia, there's any of the animals (probably Angelo, though Red XIII or Interceptor might make it). Mog is out, and I can't see Moombas or Pupus making the cut. Somehow, I think Rinoa would fill this slot nicely, because she has the whole angel wing thing and obsession with all things pink and fluffy and has Angelo to multiply the cuteness factor. And I suppose I wouldn't mind too much if it were Rinoa. Just imagine this with a puppy:

Lookee

Cute enough for the girls, but not obnoxiously cute like rainbow bunnies...

[BarretFTW]

Why won't Square just put Red mage in Kingdom hearts? Or another one of the nostalgic
classes. To fight alongside a Black belt would revive the series in my eyes.
More final fantasy, 'cuz the Disney-FF balance is way off.
Garland would be awesome as well...

[Vermilion Thanatos]

They won't just use a class because the point is to provide cameos with a little character to them.

There do happen to be characters that fall under those classes...

Red Mages: Palom and Porom, Rydia, Tellah, FuSoYa, Terra, Celes, and Lulu. If you're going by looks, there's always Freya, though she doesn't stand a shot against Kain.

Blackbelts: Josef, Guy, Yang, Sabin, Gau, Tifa (already had her), Zell, Amarant, Auron, and Snow.

Oh, damn. Forgot another thing taking up space. There will definitely be a XIII rep, though I doubt even the developers know which to use yet because the game is far from finished...I'm predicting Lightning or Sazh.

[BarretFTW]

I would say Barret, but they have overplayed the FFVII concept in KH(and he wouldn't be able to talk x=),
Firion or Bartz would be a nice choice though...
I don't think I could stand Josef... not after what happened to him, I still shed a tear

[DuMbAsS]

That why for the blackbelt we should get Yang. More FFIV love. Also he "died" and came back. Lousy bugger, just after I got over the lost of my dual-elemental-claw wielding warrior.

As for Red mage I would like Terra. It would bring some FFVI love along with a character who was pretty good. I know our own Terra might agree on this. Too bad he's not in the conversation.

Edit:
O and VT, was that your deviantArt work? Cause I just read the detail/info thing about how the skirt is to short and was wondering, if it's too short why didn't you make it a bit longer?

[Vermilion Thanatos]

I think Terra ought to have a good shot at making it in, but Yang might not simply because he's overshadowed by Kain and Cecil and possibly Rosa and FuSoYa.

And I want a Shinryu battle, dammit. :P

Skirt? What? I don't have deviant artwork up anymore...at least I think I don't...

[BarretFTW]

Cyan needs to be there though, he'd be a really interesting character.
He's the only samurai I know of with such an epic mustache.

And yes, a shinryu battle would be amazing.
But they really need to cut down the FFVII cast, it's really annoying when half the ff characters are from VII. Cloud, Aeris, Tifa, Yuffie, Cid, Sissyroth, it's just too much.
(And YRP needs to go, that game doesn't deserve to be remembered)

[Vermilion Thanatos]

Actually, X has just as many. Here's the rundown:

VI: Setzer
VII: Cloud, Tifa, Aerith, Yuffie, Vincent, Sephiroth
VIII: Squall, Seifer, Fuu, Rai
IX: Vivi
X: Tidus, Wakka, Yuna, Rikku, Paine, Auron

I wouldn't mind if they replaced a VII or X character with another from that game, but I think that about six is a nice number from each. They just need to meet that goal with nearly every other FF game. VIII would be easy to do that, but they need to add a lot more from VI, IX, and IV. And maybe II or XII or XIII. V can have maybe one or two, but I think the games with decent plots and characters take importance. Which means we need MOAR Kain, Cecil, Rosa, Golbez, Zeromus, Terra, Celes, Locke, Sabin, Cyan, Shadow, Rinoa, Zidane, Garnet, Eiko, Steiner, etc., etc., etc.

[DuMbAsS]

@VT
lol i was talking about that link you had about rinoa. never mind it though

Right, for if we get another one that has our not so great anymore hero and his won't go away villian counterpart and sales for KH goes through the roof, we won't be able to stop SE from ever doing it again. No matter what we do.

[Vermilion Thanatos]

Lol, now I see. Not my artwork. I just figured that DeviantArt would have something similar to what I was talking about. There are actually several KH Rinoas there...

And yes, I do agree that if we don't get Cloud and Sephy to leave, they never will. Though something makes me feel as though we are already past that point. I think they are almost guaranteed to be in KH III, though if I knew whom to kill to prevent it, I'd seriously consider doing it. :P

[DuMbAsS]

Well, hopefully they don't have Sephy. As I've recently posted, I won't mind a cameo featuring only one of them. Besides, we need a new optional boss. (Gilgamesh FTW!)